ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

ZModeler2-related discussion. General questions, howto, etc.

Moderator: Oleg

Post Reply
User avatar
Oleg
Site Admin
Posts: 14045
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:54 am
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Oleg »

sure, but much later than now.
BBoyJmE
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 8:40 am

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by BBoyJmE »

It might be becau I am biased towards 3DS Max, but is it possible for creating a plugin that does all the exports Zmod3 would have available in max? So, modelling, assigning correct materials and all, heirachy and all that rigging to be done in max, but upon export say for GTA, you would take all that information and compile them into the correct file format andwhat not>? bassically much like hte oldschool DFF Exporter that a guy who worked for Rockstar wrote for 3DS max, i used tha fine to import my car into SA.
User avatar
Cessna tomtom
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 2:56 pm

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Cessna tomtom »

Any news Oleg?

Have you started anything yet?
User avatar
Oleg
Site Admin
Posts: 14045
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:54 am
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Oleg »

Seems like ZMod3 will suffer of lower performance than zmod2. Even at this stage, when most of rendering code is still zmod2-based, ZMod3 shows lower framerate than ZMod2 can do... I remember the time I've developed zmod2 render code and it suffer from lower performance than ZMod1))))...

However, I expect ZMod3 to run a bit faster on higher-detailed objects due to some performance tricks and other stuff involved. An overal UI performance is slower, since more effects (like shadows, semitransparent tints and UI features) are in use. I still deciding whether "better looking" stuff worth this framerate penalty.
User avatar
Cessna tomtom
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 2:56 pm

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Cessna tomtom »

Yes, Sounds like its going great.

Umm i think maybe go for the better look than performance..

Do you have any screenshots we can peek at? :)

Or is it still in coding?
User avatar
Oleg
Site Admin
Posts: 14045
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:54 am
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Oleg »

yup, it's still in coding. Even worse, I've made some deep changes recently and still can't compile everything up, until code is updated with respect to the changes made. I'll post a screenshot few later.

Also, I expect ZMod to have a choice of running DX9 or DX10 (for Win7 users). There are some tricks in DX10 that could hit the viewport draw performance (especially the wireframe) on a higher level. An ability to have this DX9/10 choice causes a seriouse changes in code at the moment.
Jur1z
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2011 8:54 am
Location: Latvia

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Jur1z »

suggestions, wishes:
Move materials in "Materials Editor" up and down
Stargate38

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Stargate38 »

Could you please make Zmodeler 3 free (with no registration needed to import/export), like 1.07b? I just don't like the idea of having to pay to enable import/export. Also make filters for .max and Poser formats, as well as Google Sketchup (.skp), because I want to be able to import/export these formats. Also please filter out bad language on this forum (It annoys me).
User avatar
Cessna tomtom
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 2:56 pm

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Cessna tomtom »

Stargate38 wrote:Could you please make Zmodeler 3 free (with no registration needed to import/export), like 1.07b? I just don't like the idea of having to pay to enable import/export. Also make filters for .max and Poser formats, as well as Google Sketchup (.skp), because I want to be able to import/export these formats. Also please filter out bad language on this forum (It annoys me).
It will never happen, oleg makes good money from Zmodeler 2. He should make loads more from Zmodeler 3, I dont see any reason why he would make it free.
random

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by random »

My only suggestion is to maybe make zmodeler 3 a full trial version for maybe 2 weeks to a months time because i have tried literally every single (free/test version) zmod out there and none of them have half of the creation options that people claim it does.. If i could have experimented with it more and had a go or two at making a car i might have been inclined to spend 45 bux on it. To be honest tho, and no offense cuz i know Oleg works hard on this program, I wouldn't spent a cent on it experiencing what i have experienced with it so far. I much prefer the way 3ds operates over these free trials of zmodeler because i can actually make things with it xD. The only thing i found it useful for is converting files to be edited in 3ds max and then converting that file back to IV but no creation. simply conversions. i guess the "free" version don't really let you do much other than use it for a converter and don't allow for really any creation seeing as how a few things like create/surfaces/flat.. create/faces have been absent from every zmod i tried.

Just saying maybe if you give people a months time to actually try a fully operational version you might stand to make more money cuz im sure im not the only person who feels this way xD. Anyways hope you consider it or can at least point me to a version where i can mess around with making a car so i can decide to spend money on this or not and if i got a chance to experiment with the full features the odds are i would buy it.

Anyhow, thanks for reading and good luck with your new update to zm3.. :)
User avatar
Stew2000
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: East Sussex, UK
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Stew2000 »

Zmod3 would actually be worth $70 if it had a render button and animation control.
User avatar
Oleg
Site Admin
Posts: 14045
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:54 am
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Oleg »

Guys, I would like to hear your ideas on Materials Editor for ZModeler3.

At the moment the following considerations are taken as a guideline, but your ideas and improvements would make desireable changes to come real:

1. Only shader-driven materials support. Basically, you select a shader type, assign required textures and drag some sliders next to each texture.

2. There will be materials browser similar to textures browser where you can:
i) see a list of available materials (size of sample image will be adjustable instantly), +material name, +used shader, +option to toggle off rendering of this material in solid views
ii) see a subset of materials samples called "selection". This selection will display materials that are either a) used by objects that are currently selected; b) result of a search by name (material/used texture); c) set of materials that are not used in scene at all.
iii) small fly-out box with "copy" of material settings for exchange. For example, you can edit texture layer of material and "copy" these settings. a fly-out box will display settings that were "copied" (you can tick on/off some of them if you like). then you can drag and drop this "button" (or something like that) onto any material in a browser and according set of options will be copied.

remark: Drag & Drop will be widely supported in ZMod3; Drag&Drop of material entry from "list of materials" into subset/selection list will replace assignment of according materials; Sorting (changing materials order) will be done with simple drag&drop sorting methods;

3. There will be materials editor where you can
i) see a big (or even a separate resizeable window like in 3ds Max) material sample preview;
ii) change name, shader, color, transparecity and other general settings of material;
iii) assign textures onto shader-required texture slots; change settings of each texture slot;
iv) delete, copy or create new material;
v) copy any of desired material settings by draggin&dropping "something" (a button or tab, I don't know yet) into a "small fly-out box with copy of material settings" mentioned above; or onto any material in materials browser (to copy entire set of settings)..



It does look for me that we get too much windows while managing materials, but it seems to be important to separate materials browser and materials editor from each other.

P.S.
I'll dig this thread to find out where I've missed your suggestions that were posted already..
User avatar
Stew2000
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2005 3:07 am
Location: East Sussex, UK
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Stew2000 »

One request for you Oleg.
Now that CryEngine3 SDK is available for free will you be able to support it?
http://www.crydev.net/index.php
bayonet
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:23 am

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by bayonet »

Honestly, I don't see how you can get much easier to use with the zmod2 material editor. Perhaps you can make it even easier to use, because most noobs don't know what any of the advanced settings actually do, and they're kinda hidden. I dunno, I don't have much ideas for the material editor, besides the visual upgrades. I'm only really hoping you improve the tools and looks that zmod2 has, I don't think zmod3 really needs a huge change in the way it's used. Not just because I'm used to zmod2 and I fear change, but zmod is actually a very good modeling program besides lack of tools. So IMO you should concentrate on just visual upgrades, and new tools and maybe alter some of the existing tools in zmod2 so they're even more useful.
User avatar
aaro4130
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 2:50 pm

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by aaro4130 »

I would say a combination between zmod1 and zmod2 material editor, hmm, maybe select a preview object to show material object on like in ZM1 : Cube|Sphere|Cylinder, except with the objects in the scene. But maybe that is a bit too much/ too hard to do. Anyways, its just a suggestion :P .

Also, in ZM3, i would like to see more Windows-Friendly controls. And when you lose the rendering device, to have a window to restore it. to restore it just maximize all windows and restore them, then move them 1 pixel down then 1 pixel up. That works in ZM1.

Also, More customizable GUI, as in INI files and such for colors and stuff.

Also, make a "plugins" folder for *.dll and not *.zmp. Plugins are usually dll. The filters can stay as .zmf as its very appropriate, but i would suggest a folder structure similar to this:

Program Files\Zmodeler
-Filters
--3DS
---3DS\3ds.zmf
---3DS\3ds.txt
--BIN
---BIN\BIN.zmf
---BIN\BIN.txt


And maybe make the log window optional in a "Debug" menu item?

+When making the dummies, maybe make the context menu for an object include "Place dummy at center". Would be useful for GTA:SA and such.

Maybe add the LWO format again? (Sample LWO importer)
User avatar
Reinhard
Beginner
Posts: 289
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:38 am
Location: Berlin, Germany

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Reinhard »

Another suggestion:

Sometimes it is easier to test changes to material settings in a material file itself, rather than the material editor. Or to fetch good values from a template, or an existing model.

But doing so, the values of choice will be overwritten on next export. One always have to backup/restore.

It would be very nice if there would be a mechanism to import a specific material file, to replace a given material setting of the editor. To integrate changes like described before back in the Z3D, once and forever.

Another point: it would be helpful if a Zmodeler filter, on any material file import, would keep all unknown keywords and associated values in mind. And wrote them back on export, unconditionally. Example: "aux" entries in 18wos material files.
User avatar
aaro4130
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 2:50 pm

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by aaro4130 »

Reinhard wrote:Another suggestion:

Sometimes it is easier to test changes to material settings in a material file itself, rather than the material editor. Or to fetch good values from a template, or an existing model.

But doing so, the values of choice will be overwritten on next export. One always have to backup/restore.

It would be very nice if there would be a mechanism to import a specific material file, to replace a given material setting of the editor. To integrate changes like described before back in the Z3D, once and forever.

Another point: it would be helpful if a Zmodeler filter, on any material file import, would keep all unknown keywords and associated values in mind. And wrote them back on export, unconditionally. Example: "aux" entries in 18wos material files.
Yeah, it would be cool to replace them from *.mtl files and such
User avatar
Oleg
Site Admin
Posts: 14045
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:54 am
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Oleg »

What do you think about Materials Library - a set of zmodeler-style materials (with all options, user-defined options applied) stored outside of ZModeler?

The problem is that each filter has it's own materials configuration (few of them have a separate material file) and why only ETS/GTS should have an option to load material file you specify?.. additionally, an "export this material using this filter" would be needed, right?.
User avatar
Reinhard
Beginner
Posts: 289
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:38 am
Location: Berlin, Germany

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Reinhard »

Oleg wrote:What do you think about Materials Library - a set of zmodeler-style materials (with all options, user-defined options applied) stored outside of ZModeler?
Hard to say because of my lack of experience, the only filter I ever used is the ETS/GTS one, and my whole little background in modding/modeling is based on these games. So, a relation to the materials editor was obvious to me, because if I think of materials as separated items, but this isn't really important.

You mean a set of materials in a Z3D fashion, just isolated? Exchangeable in a free manner? Would be nice for collaborated work, I guess. Better don't forget to protect the read-function. :D
The problem is that each filter has it's own materials configuration (few of them have a separate material file) and why only ETS/GTS should have an option to load material file you specify?
I see. I think my real problem was to get access to a changed material without re-importing the just exported model. I'm reluctant to do this, because I use an approach with many many different, hierarchically organized named objects. This is not supported very well by the PMG file format.

But I just had an idea: if I create a modest "fake" model, consisting of only a polygon for each material of interest, I could easily export/change/re-import material settings. Sometimes I overlook the simplest approaches. :?

Anyway, a generic "import materials" option, details delegated to the specific filter, would be handy. Wherever located, materials editor or not.
additionally, an "export this material using this filter" would be needed, right?.
Not sure why. The fact that a material import took place after the initial model import should be transparent to any export?
User avatar
Oleg
Site Admin
Posts: 14045
Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2004 3:54 am
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Oleg »

Here's a quick snapshot of new materials browser for you pals. :)
ZModeler3 materials browser preview
ZModeler3 materials browser preview
Chong McBong.

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Chong McBong. »

looks good :)
let me know if you need any help beta testing it :P
User avatar
Richard
Posts: 97
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2004 4:04 am
Location: England
Contact:

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Richard »

So this Zmodeler 3 program is going to look a lot like some of the commercial software out there. As a beginner/casual modeler, it looks good and alien to me. :mrgreen:

Keep at it 8)
Flag of Nevada
Jur1z
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2011 8:54 am
Location: Latvia

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by Jur1z »

Yes its looks good, cant wait to test it :D

Also i could pay an extra price or buy another license just for gta:sa filter with lights support
fgd

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by fgd »

Export textures, and .fbx.
Open multiple files and fusion models.
bayonet
Posts: 21
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:23 am

Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Post by bayonet »

I like the way it looks, but it looks a little confusing in the picture. Maybe it isn't though, we'll see. Just don't make it anything like max 2012 and we'll be good. lol.

possibly a clear type font would go well with it. Windows 7 standard possibly.

Are you still working on tools oleg?
Post Reply