ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

ZModeler2-related discussion. General questions, howto, etc.

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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Sun Dec 11, 2011 12:13 pm

Quick poll added, please vote: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=5420
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Reinhard » Sun Dec 11, 2011 11:13 pm

Will organization of viewports still kinda flexible?

Example: with my old 4:3 display, i had Commands Bar on top of Scene Nodes Browser, to give the model views as much room as possible. Now with a broader 16:9 display, I use both floaters side-by-side. If such choice is still possible, I'm fine with floaters gone. If not...
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Mon Dec 12, 2011 12:31 am

ZModeler3 will have horizontal commands bar. Something like MS Office ribbon (very alike, but not a ribbon actually).
Here's an example of layout on my 1280x1024 screen:
Attachments
zmodeler3_layout.gif
ZModeler3 UI layout
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby aaro4130 » Tue Dec 13, 2011 3:49 am

Maybe have a non "Flat" style buttons on the tabs, maybe customize them with your own little ZMButton (background image property).

The thing at the bottom.. There should be tabs for like

"Import Log" "Program Log" "Export Log"

Just a couple more ideas., Looks good so far :)

EDIT: Maybe re-add in some old commands (CTRL+M for Move tool, CTRL+S For Faces>Strip)
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:39 am

aaro4130 wrote:Maybe have a non "Flat" style buttons on the tabs, maybe customize them with your own little ZMButton (background image property).

The thing at the bottom.. There should be tabs for like

"Import Log" "Program Log" "Export Log"

Just a couple more ideas., Looks good so far :)

EDIT: Maybe re-add in some old commands (CTRL+M for Move tool, CTRL+S For Faces>Strip)

The UI is no loner "flat". I don't claim it's superb, but it's really nice looking now :)

Tabs in a message log... I don't think it's really needed.. I think you should see warnings or errors as soon as they occures, so you don't scroll up/down to see what was happening here times ago. There are no log messages in ZModeler actually, It doesn't log importing or exporting routines, it can flash warnings or errors.

Concerning "old commands" - you can assign desired hotkey for any tool as you like. Options\Settings\Hotkeys.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Quentin88 » Tue Dec 13, 2011 5:11 pm

can you make it so multiple items/nodes can be moved at a time, eg from different dummy nodes in the object tree.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:06 pm

aready done.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Reinhard » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:16 pm

Great! I missed that, too. What about adding a right click option toggle for "select"/deselect" the viewport objects which are currently selected in the scene nodes browser?
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:41 pm

hmmm.. not a right-click, but some synchro between scene selection and browser selection should be made. I'll think on this idea.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Reinhard » Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:10 am

Fine. I´ve always missed something like this, thanks.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:14 pm

I've decieded to grab a facebook username for ZModeler to avoid some third-party squatters or fake pages.

"ZModeler3" user account is taken for ZModeler3 product:

http://www.facebook.com/ZModeler3/

"ZModeler" user account is taken for me personally, but I'm not about to use it.

By the way, the "slowness" bug under Window7 that was reported may times (starting from versino 2.2.5) have been fixed. I don't have a Win7 with development environment installed, so I just use to run ZModeler3 on laptop from a network drive to make quick tests. As far as I see, the slowness issue is solved (yup, there was an extreemly slow rendering performance in viewports).

Also, I think ZModeler3 will be supplied with all the libraries DLLs needed all in one. Since ZModeler has it's own auto update routines, it would be possible to update these libraries too. As far as I see, Microsoft permits to redistribute their libraries this way when end user libraries update is performed by software. So, I think we'll not see "Invalid side by side configuration.. blah blah blah" startup error anymore. DirectX installation is a must of cause, but certain "helpers and utilities" library that comes with DirectX will be included in ZModeler3 installation package.

Just a quick overview of guideline and associated timeline:
1. Complete porting of ZModeler2 tools to ZModeler3. (no new tools introduced at the moment). Estimated: December 2011;
2. Properties sheet convertion to realtime "selection properties" spot. January 2012;
3. Context menu (right-click) replacement with quick "tools set and switches". Not sure whether this will be included in initial release, may be omited and old school context menu will be present; January 2012;
4. Skeleton and bones improvement; Inverse kinematics; Animation table; January-Feburary 2012;
5. Software protection and code safity related touchups; Auto update support; Estimated: March 2012;
6. Site or Portal for ZModeler3 users: Estimated: March 2012; First beta testing is scheaduled to this timeframe too.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby wes » Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:19 am

Hey Oleg, I'm really looking forward to ZM3. There is one thing I hope you take seriously: ZM2 never had the overwhelming success of ZM1 as a modelling program, although it was better by faaaaaaar! I think it was because it was less user-friendly. There were a couple of reasons for it, the most important ones: When zm2 was first released it was unstable and lacked tools, and many people gave it up already before the stable versions came out. I don't think it is wise to do this again. Second reason: It was not tweaked optimally. For example, there were barely hot-keys assigned. I once tweaked the hotkeys so that you barely have to use the shift and ctrl and alt keys. It was a huge improvement. So maybe it is an idea to invite experienced users for feedback, before it is released in public. This way it should be received better by the public and get the recognition it deserves.

Furthermore, as I am a modeller, will zm3 be more a modelling program or a converting program?
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:33 pm

Yes, it's a good idea to make a restricted group of advanced users so they can betatest and suggest tweaks and improvements before zm3 is released to the public. But who will decided whether certain user is advanced enough? :)

Concerning the lack of tools, it's a problem that I aware of.. Even more, I can't yet suggest new tools for zm3; there are several of planned tools but none of them have been considered to be released initially. I would think closely on this consideration again, but I can't promise any sophisticated tools like meshSmooth or meshOptimize to be made eventually and available in initial release.

Concerning your second question, I afraid ZM can't become satisfying modelling software until it offers professional set of modelling tools. Even worse, modern games afford very high poly count on models, so nowdays you are free to use splines and surfaces for modelling 3d game content. ZM3 lacks of splines and surfaces at the moment. If I had another couple of sponsored monthes for development, I could take care of this too. :?
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Wes » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:55 pm

Personally, I think for modelling the ONLY tool that I'm missing is a edge divide tool that divides multiple edges and connects the vertices. It's the way I model in other programmes I tried (but maybe I'm oldschool :P). However I always come back to my beloved zm2 anyway...:P Just keep up the good work!
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Mon Dec 19, 2011 10:38 pm

I think "edge slice" tool will be made that can go cross-edge or cross-poly as long as you lay the slice-line. new vertices and edges will be created where needed. I think a it will be an extra behaviour of the knife tool.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby carking1996 » Thu Dec 29, 2011 5:06 am

Oleg: Could there please be an extrusion of edges in ZM3? That would be very helpful when modeling to produce faster, better results. Thanks!
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Thu Dec 29, 2011 5:16 am

you can extrude edges in zm2.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Transporter » Sat Dec 31, 2011 8:28 am

Hi

I know how to develop plugins with the 3ds max SDK. Oleg, would you be agreeable to a 3ds max export plugin for Zmodeler3's save file format? I would of course need info on the structure of the file.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Sat Dec 31, 2011 12:04 pm

.z3d format is pretty messy nowdays and very dependent on ZModeler plugins. In general, there are no straightward format documentations. Each plugin, each object or material in scene can write it's own portion of data into .z3d file, so I doubt it would be possible to document each plugin read/write behaviour. :?
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Hingey23 » Sun Jan 01, 2012 3:32 pm

Hi Oleg, I'm sure it's been said previously but I just wanna check, will ZM3 be able to rename a heap of nodes at once?

Thanks.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Sun Jan 01, 2012 8:56 pm

how do you imagine this? a wildcard rename? or bulk rename to the same name?
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Aaro4130_notloggedin » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:13 am

[quote="Oleg"]how do you imagine this? a wildcard rename? or bulk rename to the same name?[/quote]

Im thinking suffix based

say we have

Unnamed_1
Unnamed_2
Unnamed_3
+ 100 more


we do (REPLACE SUFFIX : Unnamed WITH : OBject)

Now

Object_1 etc
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Kotton » Sun Jan 08, 2012 6:41 pm

donno if it's been discussed yet, haven't gone thru the entire thread.. but will there be better base options for the materials?

for example, with Zm2, if I mostly mod gta4, I need the gta4 base materials, which takes the place of other important base materials used in other modding..
so in other words, if I want to mod gta4, then turn right around and mod SA, VC, or III, or Shift and/or TDU, I'm either fucked or need multiple copies of Zm :?
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Oleg » Sun Jan 08, 2012 11:19 pm

if i'm not mistaken, you are talking about texture apply settings with a named settings like "GTA4: BumpMap" and like this? You can have multiple settings stored and they can overlap in settings and been stored multiple times.

Concerning the user-defined values like "GTA4:BUMP" and others, they can't be converted, since they are solely for certain filter; on the other hand, each filter will not be messed on export if "unnecessary" settings are defined on material.
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Re: ZModeler3 suggestions/wishes

Postby Kotton » Mon Jan 09, 2012 10:41 am

yes, when we apply the "GTA4_textures.xml", many of the normal texture options are replaced by those.. and they should be added to the existing options, not replace existing options

so I'm asking if this will be addressed in Zm3 -or- if you can modify the xml file to where it ADDS those gta4 texture options instead of replacing the existing, that would be awesome to
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